WHIRLPOOL Washer - replaced timer control

[progman63]

The cycles stopped advancing. All cycles worked properly (manually advancing) but would not advance automatically.  No sound from the timer motor either (you could hear the motor humming as it turned). Easy assumption it was the timer control.

Replaced timer control (original bolts didn't fit since no threads on new unit, so had to replace with machine screws).

Same thing - cycles work but do not advance automatically, manual advance cycles work properly, no sound from timer motor.

I'll visually inspect the connector again, but what else could cause this?

Only control components, all in the panel, are the control timer, water temp switch, extra rinse rocker switch, water level switch, and large capacitor. Everything else is mechanical parts and the wiring harness.

(Wiring harness no longer available and I didn't really want to go there anyway!!!)

Model LA7800XTW1

Whirlpool Washer Timer Part # 3351744

[RegUS_PatOff]

Timer may be binding, mechanically.

Is there voltage at the Timer Motor ?

[JWWebster]

How long was them screws you used?

[progman63]

I was going to look at the timer to try to isolate the motor tabs so I could try to test them with a meter. I did not see any corrosion on any of the tabs, but I'll clean them and rough them up a little to make sure there's good contact on the connector spades.

The fact that the old timer and the new timer were doing the same thing lead me to believe that the same problem was still occurring. Which might mean power to the motor or a connection or something similar, but that meant it would have had to happen on it's own for the old timer to quit. Maybe moisture, or vibration, or (hopefully not) a worn wire somewhere.

There doesn't appear to be anything else that controls the timer - components or circuits - except for the wiring harness on the exploded view or parts list in the manual. Not even a fuse. But there's no circuit diagram provided so it's hard to tell.

The original bolts were about 1/4", and the metal screws might be about 1/8" longer, but the dial turns manually with no resistance or binding.

When I shine a light in to the metal casing from the side and turn the knob, it looks like there's a large hollow plastic timing drum (like the metal drums on those little music box mechanisms) with raised prongs all around the outside to actuate the contacts for all the various functions of each cycle like water fill, agitate, spin, etc.

There do not appear to be any internal ribs or supports inside the drum, at least that I can see, coming anywhere near the screw holes that would catch on the screws if they projected too far inside the enclosure.

[jumptrout51]

You say all cycles work manually...
Water fill.
Agitation.
Rinse.
Spin ALL work manually?

[JWWebster]

Look and see if one of the timer motor wires has came loose.

[progman63]

Yes, all appear to work properly. I will stand there after water fill and a period of agitation to wash a load, push the knob off, turn till I hear an actuator click off the drum, pull on, let the next cycle run for a while, push off, turn, click, pull on, etc.

There is a service diagram on the inside of the rear panel - see attached.

After the tub filled I measured AC off the timer spades (motor unplugged inside enclosure) of the new timer attached to the machine while agitating and got about 110AC, same as when I tested the meter on the outlet.

I plugged the old timer in unattached from the machine and also got 110 AC. While I was plugging the motor back in on the old timer I saw the timer cam turn for a short period and then stop.

I've never seen the timer cam on the new motor move but never really watched it before, just felt for a running vibration.

I thought maybe there was a loose connection, either going into the wiring harness connector or a broken wire in the harness nearby, but it appears that I consistently get 110AC off both motors even when the cam is not moving on either.

[progman63]

Look and see if one of the timer motor wires has came loose.

I've unplugged and replugged the motor connectors several times while testing both timers, but is there a way I can test the motor itself?

Would you get a resistance off the leads of the motor? Never tried that on a motor before.

I guess I could just connect the motor right into the outlet to see if it runs straight off the current without any other components. It's rated 115AC 60hz.....

[JWWebster]

You got a bad timer. If the motor was good while in the ON position you should get 0 volts between the motor terminals. If you get 120 volts there then the motor is open (bad)
If the motor was good you should be able to get continuity between the 2 timer motor wires also. Sometimes a motor can have continuity and still be bad because the gears get stripped  on it little shaft.

[RegUS_PatOff]

   

Is there voltage at the Timer Motor ?

probe the (2) single white connectors

[progman63]

Naw, I had disconnected the motor inside the enclosure and tested off the spades the motor was connected to, to see what the machine was sending to the motor. And no room in there to test with them connected anyway.

Look a the pic Regus posted (tnx!). I pulled the white connectors off the spades, which come off the top of the enclosure's connection block, and tested what was coming in through the connection block.

Last stop before you get to the motor leads themselves, and hopefully would show any faulty connections.

So the motor was disconnected.

Also, I just tested both old and new motor leads, unconnected, and got continuity (very small ohm reading) off both motors.

That's what has me so confused - it appears we have power to the motor(s) and both motors test the same. Although they both could be binding.

Either I'm screwing something up with testing (really couldn't screw up connecting the controllers, there's  a pin out diagram on the enclosure I triple checked, and a notch out to ensure you don't plug them in backward, and the cycles work manually, I did a load yesterday with the new controller in), or both controllers are messed up, or something else is wrong. And I can't see what.

I'll try running the motors straight from the power receptacle and see if they respond at all.

Tnx for all your help guys.

[RegUS_PatOff]

You would need to test for voltage, at the White Connectors,
while the Motor is connected ..

You may have to use lengths of wires to "extend" your meter probes ..

[progman63]

OK, I'll give that a go.

Will that test the draw from the motor?
(never worked with motors before)

Because it reads 110AC on the terminals.
Same as testing a wall outlet for live power.

Tnx.

[RegUS_PatOff]

Because it reads 110AC on the terminals.

If it reads 110AC (while connected) and it's not moving, then the Timer Motor is bad, or stuck.

[JWWebster]

You should not get any reading if the motor is good. Why? If the motor is working you would only get a one way flow of power or one side of the circuit, therefore nothing would show up on the meter. Their is no break in the circuit. If the object you are testing is bad then the current flow is interrupted and the alternating current registers the voltage at that point from both sides of the motor. Confused yet? Head scratcher ain't it. LOL