Author Topic: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin  (Read 476 times)

Offline part-time spinner

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Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« on: March 09, 2014, 06:11:04 PM »
I've been doing a lot of research and trying to narrow down the cause of this problem:

First, it is a Whirlpool Estate Direct Drive washer model TAWS700RQ2 with a ONE PIECE agitator (so NO DOGS to replace). This one piece agitator must not be very common because the only advice I ever see concerning weak agitation is to replace the dogs, which only exist on two piece agitators....so this is obviously not a solution for my machine.

The first problem we noticed was that our clothes were no longer getting rinsed well and we had to run extra rinse cycles to get the soap out. We noticed that the clothes were not rolling in the basket as they should, but more like jiggling in place. We do not overload. This happens with small loads. So I'm guessing that this is what is called “weak agitation”.

Now we have another problem. The clothes are wet after the spin cycle. They are sitting in the bottom of the basket, not spun up against the side of the basket as they should be. The water drains out fine and there is no water sitting anywhere or dripping into the basket after the spin. Again, this happens with small loads, not just large loads. This is also sporadic and inconsistent. I can run the same load (never take it out of the washer) several times and sometimes it will be soaking wet, sometimes not as much, but always much wetter than it should be under normal operating conditions.

What I know so far:

I ran through an entire cycle with just water and observed everything. I peeked under the lid with a flashlight and watched without tripping the lid switch. It looked like it was agitating back and forth correctly (no clothes, just water). The cycles worked as they should. The water drains fine and the pump is new. During spin, the tub was spinning and seemed to spin faster at the end of the cycle just fine (empty of course). The motor and timer seem to be working just fine. The lid switch has always worked exactly as it's designed. If I lift the lid, I can see the spin come to a stop. If I close it, I hear the click and the machine begins to run again. I don't hear any unusual noises. I don't hear any banging indicative of a worn drive block. There are no burning smells. There is no oil or black dust under the machine.

The machine seemed to run fine empty, but fails to agitate and spin correctly as soon as you put a small load of clothes in.

I'm narrowing it down to the following and trying to make sure I get all potential parts ordered before we tear into this thing so I can hopefully fix it at the same time:

1. Clutch Assembly – if it's worn, would it cause weak agitation and no spin when clothes are causing weight in the basket?
2. Motor Coupler – I looked under the machine and it doesn't look broken, but I can't see if the hole is rounded out causing it to slip and not grab the transmission shaft.
3. Drive Block – I don't have any noise, so I doubt this, but I can return it.

It is my understanding that if the 3 items above are fine and not the cause of the problem, then the cause is the gearcase/transmission and the only way to find out is to eliminate the above parts as potential problems.

Any advice, thoughts? Am I missing something?

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2014, 06:57:35 PM »
Quote
Clutch Assembly – if it's worn, would it cause weak agitation and no spin when clothes are causing weight in the basket

The clutch would not cause weak agitation.

Could the agitator splines be getting stripped out?

About how old is this washer?

Offline part-time spinner

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2014, 07:19:22 PM »
The washer came with the house, but I would say it's about 6 - 10 years old. Since both of these things didn't happen at the same time, I'm wondering if I don't have two separate issues and maybe one has nothing to do with the other? I need to take the agitator off and see what moves with what as well as look at the condition of the splines and drive block.

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2014, 07:27:49 PM »
The way this washer works is after it's done draining the timer will pause the motor. It's during this pause that the transmission drops into the spin mode. Then the timer puts voltage to the drive motor and the transmission spins the clutch, clutch spins tube, spine tube is attached to the basket via the drive block.

Make sure the timer is pausing in between the end of the drain cycle and the start of the spin cycle. If it's not then you have a problem with the timer.

If the timer is ok I would suspect the clutch needs to be replaced to correct your spin problem.

As for the week agitation the only thing I can think of is the agitator is stripped out or the transmission is getting week. I would suspect that one piece agitator before the transmission, but it's something you will just have to inspect first.

The agitator is connected directly to the top of the transmission shaft, so there is nothing in between that could make it agitate poorly.
Unlike the spin cycle where you have the clutch, spin tub, break and drive block all in between the transmission and the basket.

Hope that helps.

Let us know what you find.

Offline part-time spinner

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2014, 07:39:23 PM »
I am a little confused about the neutral drain function. Last night, I was doing an empty test run. When the tub was draining, it started spinning while it still had half a tub of water in it. I lifted the lid all the way and everything stopped. When I put the lid back down, it finished draining the water, but didn't start spinning and never went into the spin cycle after. I have a load with clothes in it right now. I'm going to peek at it to see what happens without lifting the lid and causing it to stop, just enough so I can see if it's spinning and when. I wish I could do the screwdriver trick on this one, but I can't. I would have to make a jumper in order to bypass the lid switch. I will see if there is a pause between drain and spin also.

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2014, 07:47:18 PM »
Quote
Last night, I was doing an empty test run. When the tub was draining, it started spinning while it still had half a tub of water in it. I lifted the lid all the way and everything stopped. When I put the lid back down, it finished draining the water, but didn't start spinning and never went into the spin cycle after.

Sounds like the neutral drain is going out on the transmission.

Clutch could have been slipping too, but if it had been slipping for any length of time you probably would have smelt it.

If you could remove the cabinet and jump out the lid switch then you could watch it during the spin cycle.

If during the spin cycle the washer is not spinning, the motor is running, the motor coupler is ok and the clutch is not spinning then you have a bad transmission.

Offline markcoby98

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2014, 06:37:31 PM »
Check out the obvious first...
Check or replace the coupler (I have found that the "Heavy Duty" couplers /with the metal insert can "strip" and WILL slip, although the coupler & rubber bushing will look fine!!!
( You can test the inserts by placing needle nose pliers (closed) into the inserts & try to turn the 3 legged spline, if you can turn it, the insert is slipping!!!) Replace the whole coupler...

If ok, next...
 
Remove the agitator to check if any clothing is wrapped around the stem...

Remove tub cover and check for clothing stuck between tub & basket...

Check out the drive block... (while the agitator is out)

Check that the pump is turning freely ( I have found string, shredded chothing, wire & shoe laces wrapped around the impeller & hub) thus causing a high drag by the pump & wasting motor power....

If all the above is ok.... Replace the spin clutch assembly
(while in there inspect the BRAKE spring, if broke replace it)

IF STILL NO SPIN   PUNT
GET ANOTHER WASHER
It may be the gear case, although very rare...

MARKS-MOWERS / REASONABLE WASHER & DRYER REPAIR
Rochester, NY
Markcoby98
PEACE☮☯☺✌

PS...
Check that water is not siphoning back into the washer after final spin...
Clogged drain or a plugged air break!!!
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 06:47:59 PM by markcoby98 »

Offline part-time spinner

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2014, 09:30:15 PM »
It's looking like it might be the neutral drive failing. When it runs correctly, everything does what it should, agitates, drains, rinses, drains, and spins and gets faster for final spin. Clothes are washed with no soap residue and spun out without being overly wet.

Twice now, I've seen it start spinning while it's half full of water before it's done draining, then it stops spinning, finishes draining. Then it doesn't spin at all after that. If this happens when it's supposed to be draining the soapy water out, that would indeed leave soapy water in the clothes. If it happens after the final rinse, that means it does a little spin while the water is draining out, but never spins after all the water has drained out, leaving soaking wet clothes on the bottom.

If that's the case, that may be the whole problem right there, which isn't good obviously $$$

Sound right?

Offline part-time spinner

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2014, 09:33:42 PM »
I meant neutral drain, not drive. I didn't mean to turn the washing machine into a vehicle.  :)

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2014, 09:38:36 PM »

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2014, 09:40:33 PM »
Neutral drain kit instruction sheet attached.

Offline Maintech

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2014, 07:18:51 PM »
AJ

Never knew that these kits existed.. or guidelines tell us to replace tranny if no neutral drain, We just throw in a a new or rebuilt one and send the old one to rebuild

Offline jason1979g

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2014, 07:41:31 PM »
Also chance the transmission while your replacing the neutral drain gear
part # 350572

Offline AJ

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Re: Weak agitation, clothes wet after spin
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2014, 07:55:03 PM »
AJ

Never knew that these kits existed.. or guidelines tell us to replace tranny if no neutral drain, We just throw in a a new or rebuilt one and send the old one to rebuild



An't it great how we can all learn so much from each other.  :cheers:

 

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