Author Topic: stove top shocking  (Read 383 times)

Offline archibald tuttle

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stove top shocking
« on: March 31, 2014, 05:18:21 PM »
Got an early, i.e. 1975, frigidaire electric stove.  everything looks in good shape but there is about 50 or 60 volts showing on the surface of one of the burners.

Don't know what's up with that.  never experienced current leakage from a burner before - at least not that i noticed - in 30 years of working on stoves.

surface of stove and other three burners show nothing but this one element shows distinct potential.

the porcelain contact mount for these burners has springs behind flat contact points and the burner is pushed up against them and held in place by a small tab on one of the burner support arms opposite the contacts that inserts into a small hole in the sheetmetal flange of the stove top.

a few hits online speak about spurious current on burners being grounded through the metal burner supports that are attached to mounting hardware that is screwed to or pressed against stovetop surfaces.

these plug in burners have a steel tie between the burner support arms and a small bridge piece between the two burner contacts that sort of contacts some mounting steel attached to the stove top when the burner iis insterted into the plug.

But it obviously can't be making very good contact because i didn't find the voltage on the rest of the stove surface, only on the burner.  And even if it were to contact the rest of the stove this would just place potential on the entire stove, which doesn't seem to smart.  There was no electical drain or ground or 4th wire on heavy appliances in those days so i have no idea how this would actually have grounded the loose potential.

what does anyone know about this phenomenon.  I could just get another burner, but i have to admit i'm kind of mystified by the whole thing and looking for any input anyone has about this.

thanks,

brian

Offline theoldstoveguy

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Re: stove top shocking
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2014, 08:54:55 AM »
2 large and 2 small burners? Did you try switching the burners and checking voltage? Sounds like an old Westinghouse style burner.

Offline archibald tuttle

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Re: stove top shocking
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2014, 11:31:17 AM »
old stove guy.  unfortunately 3 small and 1 large and it is the large that is acting up so i can probably get a small and something to hold it into the socket.  don't know if i can take the large burner i suspect and try it on another socket however because of the burner size problem.

struck me as odd, if there is a 'drain' function that this voltage only appears on the one burner and it makes me suspect the burner itself which i'll try to see if i can confirm that, but i had never even experienced free voltage of this sort on a burner assembly.

and older stoves -- not even that old -- don't have a wired drain that i'm aware of.  no idea how many amps this leak could support.  have to think about how i'd even test that.

assume if it just goes away with a new burner that is a 'fix', but how would anyone know if they had a problem other than getting shocked?

maybe this is just very rare.  first time i've seen it. 

brian

Offline theoldstoveguy

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Re: stove top shocking
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2014, 02:02:45 PM »
Try moving the receptacle from a small to the large burner ( with the wires attached if they reach) That would be my best bet, even if it were under the top you can still test voltage.

Offline archibald tuttle

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Re: stove top shocking
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2014, 06:58:15 AM »
I was able to use a small block of wood to braced a smaller burner into the large burner socket.  no current leakage. it really does appear that the ceramic insulation in the burner has failed although i do not see any  failure.  .  i ordered a new element.  chromalox has an MP412 that appears to be the right fit for this Westinghouse stove.

Has anyone experienced this kind of phenomenon before.  As i've said, i never encountered it.  Makes me wonder if I should be using a hot tub service for stoves these days.

You don't use ground fault on refrigerators because nuisance tripping might not be discovered and can cause loss of food so, on balance, it is an exception to the general rule about appliances in kitchen counters.

These larger 220 style GFI installs cost maybe a hundred bucks plus installation instead of $10 bucks plus installation. And I am a big exponent of not turning the electric code into an encyclopedia for sissies.  Maybe this is a really rare happening and made moreso by ceramic/glass surfaces that have become prevalent.  If I have only seen this once in 30 years it isn't necessarily a clarion call for larger action.

The main thing that concerns me is, how many stoves might manifest this symptom without anyone knowing?  And a drain, if you have a four wire plug or separate drain wire bond to ground, would only mask the problem. Since current takes all paths to ground proportionate to resistance, if a user provides another ground they can get their share despite ground bonding.

Thoughts?

thanks,

brian

Offline DaleCaskanette

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Re: stove top shocking
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2014, 10:13:11 AM »
i have seen this before customers get a shock when they use a pot with a metal handle, the burner is the problem.  not a common problem see it every couple years.

 

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