365-Day Hassle Free Return Policy!  ·  AppliancePartsPros.com
Washer Parts  ·  Dryer Parts  ·  Refrigerator Parts  ·  Dishwasher Parts  ·  Range & Oven Parts  ·  All Appliance Parts 

Author Topic: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...  (Read 202 times)

Offline andersenappliance

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 776
  • Country: us
Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« on: July 30, 2013, 11:20:39 AM »
Does anybody use these timer schematics when diagnosing the machine?  They often fill up half of the tech sheet, like this one:

http://appliancejunk.com/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12538.0;attach=7114

I'm curious, because although I can read through them and discover a few things, they've never helped me fix a machine.  If the timer is faulty, then there are ways to narrow that down.  If it is something else, then you can figure that out.  And you can't repair the timer.

I've never done factory authorized work, so I was wondering if the guys who do use them.  Is there a reason that they are included?

Please don't flame me.   :thanks:

Offline theoldstoveguy

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Jan 2008
  • Posts: 1413
  • Country: us
    • Buy me a beer through paypal
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2013, 04:27:45 PM »
Depends on the machine, dishwashers for instance need to know where the soap cup opens. Most everything now is electronic with diagnostic modes but before you needed that diagram.

Offline Cananot

  • Technician
  • Member Since: May 2013
  • Posts: 116
  • Country: us
  • Technician for 13 years and still getting stumped
    • Buy me a beer through paypal
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2013, 06:23:18 PM »
I find them useful in microwaves and always good to have the legend when your training new guys which are slowly fading away ..

Offline Wedgeman55

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Aug 2008
  • Posts: 1022
  • Country: us
  • Man vs Appliance - Never give up, Never surrender
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2013, 03:58:57 AM »
I agree that with the electronic machine controls,  the timer cam chart is becoming a thing of the past.   But, I used to use them all the time,  and  on some of the manual commercial timers I ran across it was very important.   Gave you the ability to check the contacts that are supposed to be closed or opened at any given part of cycle.   Tells you when soap box opened,  or when valves are opened,  spray rinses,  etc.   If machine wasn't working right, you could check the cam chart to see when something was going to be actuated.   Nice part was you could check contacts right at timer and not have to go through entire machine. 
Commercial Laundry repair Tech and Installer  1973 to 1980
Service Manager / Technician Commercial Laundry repair company 1980 to 2002
Refrigeration - HVAC - Boiler School 1974-1976
Electronic School 1978-1979
Self Employed Appliance Repair Company 2002 to present

Offline andersenappliance

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 776
  • Country: us
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2013, 11:17:14 AM »
"Nice part was you could check contacts right at timer and not have to go through entire machine. "

That makes sense.  I guess I've learned the lion's share of this stuff through self-study, and have not had the advantage of going to  manufacturer's training.  I get a problem, I generally look at the way the machine operates, identify possible sources for the problem, then dig in and check those components.

Sometimes I have dumb questions.  I hope that doesn't offend anyone too badly.

Offline go400

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2013
  • Posts: 303
  • Country: us
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2013, 11:40:04 AM »
I would keep a bad timer and take it apart and see if you can put it back together again. Most Maytag timers have a plastic insulating bar that's hard to put back
 Most other timers, you just have to move the ratchet arm back to get the cam down all the way, then slide in the contact assembly to get it back together. When I take a timer apart, I look
 for a really bad set of contacts where there is real bad damage. If you can't find one, for most newer timers, it's probably ok and you have other problems.

Offline andersenappliance

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 776
  • Country: us
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2013, 02:52:53 PM »
Yeah, I've done that.  It is interesting to get into these things and see how they work.  I have two timers that are in great shape.  The contacts on both have burnt, and so I filed 'em just like the points on a VW motor when you tune it up.  They work great, but I haven't sold 'em as used 'cause I'm not sure how long they'll last. 

Offline go400

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2013
  • Posts: 303
  • Country: us
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2013, 03:48:51 AM »
If there is a lot of metal worn off a set of contacts, it's not repairable, if just a carbon glob, you can use a jewelers file
 and clean it off and the timer will work reliably, just burnish the contacts with fine emorey  paper to prevent an arc weld.

Offline Wedgeman55

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Aug 2008
  • Posts: 1022
  • Country: us
  • Man vs Appliance - Never give up, Never surrender
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2013, 04:02:42 AM »
The problem I have found with filing silver contacts is they will not last long after that.    They have a finish on them when they are new,  and when you file them they just don't last that much longer.    I used to work on the old GE clamshell timers (most of you youngsters don't know what I'm talking about) and the whole timer had replaceable parts.    When you removed timer switches = WH12X94,  WH12X97 etc,   you could file burnt contacts easily.    But when you did,  it was only short term.    I did this when I didn't have part and I wanted to get the machine going.     Then come back in a week or two and replace it with new one.   

I also used to take apart the some of the old maytag timers (difficult) and whirlpool (also difficult) to try to fix some of them,  but it never worked out good most of the time.   
Commercial Laundry repair Tech and Installer  1973 to 1980
Service Manager / Technician Commercial Laundry repair company 1980 to 2002
Refrigeration - HVAC - Boiler School 1974-1976
Electronic School 1978-1979
Self Employed Appliance Repair Company 2002 to present

Offline go400

  • Technician
  • Member Since: Feb 2013
  • Posts: 303
  • Country: us
Re: Ignorant question, perhaps, but here I go...
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2013, 08:14:15 AM »
You are probably right Wedgman, when you file off the contacts, they never get the good spring tension that prevents excessive arcing on a high current, inductive load.
 On low current contacts for water solenoids, sometimes you can just spray the contacts with non-residue contact cleaner and that will fix them.

 

Whirlpool Cabrio Bearing Question

Started by blondejon

Replies: 7
Views: 176
Last post May 24, 2012, 06:02:10 PM
by blondejon
GE Frontload question

Started by Repair-man

Replies: 2
Views: 50
Last post December 17, 2008, 04:57:38 AM
by Repair-man
Let and "Ole Dog" ask a question

Started by Icehouse

Replies: 8
Views: 95
Last post April 17, 2009, 09:34:52 AM
by Icehouse
Another Used Appliance Question

Started by blondejon

Replies: 8
Views: 159
Last post November 12, 2011, 11:54:37 AM
by AJ
Tool Question

Started by ScottyMo1

Replies: 9
Views: 252
Last post January 12, 2012, 06:35:22 PM
by theoldstoveguy
I have a question for you...

Started by AJ

Replies: 4
Views: 97
Last post June 24, 2012, 08:26:38 PM
by theoldstoveguy